Kennyd

My only suggestion would be to possibly check out the rental yards to see what brands they rent so you can try different ones out...What do the other contractors in your area use? Around here it's Bobcat, CAT, JD in that order-I never see any Kubota's although I here they are very nice machines.

John Deere 4110HST
FEL, MMM, FEL Forks (homemade),I-Match, Ballast Box, #380 plow (modified to fit) Markham LD-48 Grapple, and lots of other STUFF.

Dougster

Actually, I just located a new rental yard not too far away that has some near new CAT 303's for rent AND for sale. That's gonna be the first rental machine I try this spring. Problem is that I barely break even when I rent. Giving up a big job's entire profit can be awfully hard to swallow in my circumstances... so I'll probably do what I can with the 509 and see if I can limit my "test rental" to one or two good days. The other rental places near me have an interesting mix of mini-excavators but not necessarily a lot to offer in that one particular (3.5 metric ton) size that's of interest to me.

Unfortunately, renting a Bobcat 331 means one heck of a long drive out of my way. I can't imagine I could justify it unless I just happened by chance to land a job not far from the rental place. Same with the Yanmar... only farther yet.

Dougster

Kennyd

Yeah, I realize it's not cost-effective to rent, but the seat time and real-world experience may just prove to be priceless...

Not sure I would buy one from a rental yard-but that may be your only option depending on your area. Rental units typically live a very hard life so the rental yards sell them after a year or two because they get beat up so fast.

John Deere 4110HST
FEL, MMM, FEL Forks (homemade),I-Match, Ballast Box, #380 plow (modified to fit) Markham LD-48 Grapple, and lots of other STUFF.

Dougster

That's certainly a fact! I've looked at a handful of ex-daily rentals and it's hard to believe how badly they are beat up.

That company I mentioned renting the CAT 303 (and larger) excavators appears to be more focused on construction professionals and long-term leasing... however, their "for sale" prices clearly reflect that fact. Very nice machines but relatively high asking prices!

Dougster

irwin

Doug: check this out..YouTube - Kubota kx 91-3

Shows the tight space this sized beast can get into, if you have a 40 ton crane.

.... Tim

irwin

I'm with you Dougster, soon as I win the powerball I'm getting me one.
Kubota Tractor Corporation - KX Series - KX91-3 Compact Excavators Features, that looks great!

.... Tim

Dougster

Crazy video!!! Why didn't they just use a mini-skidsteer like a Dingo???
Now Tim... I need this for my business and my economic survival!!!

Sounds like you just want one to have some fun!!!

Dougster

SkunkWerX

Dougster,

I'm with you, I would love to have a Mini-X. I rented a Bobcat model to do some septic tank work, dug up some tree stumps, put about 20 hours or so on it. I loved it!

In the little bit of looking I have done, I have found that the late model, under 2,000 hour units still garner a hefty price tag. Junkers not as much, but like tractors, they tend to settle to a price range and hold there for a long time. So, I can't help you on the price factor, and, like Paul, I can't adaopt you either!

Now, let's talk about your #4 item, a standard construction backhoe.

I am a little familiar with your neck of the woods, rocky areas, where you could really use a "mean machine". Something like a Case or JD construction hoe is the real deal. The other thing about them is you can keep them busy, not just your work, but as an excavation sub to plumbers, builders, landscapers, etc. etc. I guess you could say the same about a Mini-X, but you just see a lot more traditional backhoes on jobsites. I guess due to their versatility? My neighbor has a backhoe for his building business, but when it isn't digging his own foundations, septics, etc. it's always got work elsewhere for others!
He has work lined up for it always, and his operator has to beg for time off. It's always coming or going, never sits idle.

So, that is just a thought, for future business operations. The more a machine can be working at a job site, the more it can be making money for you.

good luck

Kubota BX2350 and more attachments than I have sense to operate.

Dougster

All excellent observations Skunk! Your assessment of local conditions is right on the money (unfortunately!!!). Your post goes right to the core question of which machine is most likely to see my business still alive at the end of this coming digging season... or dead with an equipment fire sale going on in my front yard as I put on a tie, pickup a briefcase and head back to a dreaded office jail cell.

This is not an easy decision for me (can you tell?) and I still am actively shopping all options mere weeks away from the start of digging season. I have workable plans in place... different plans... for the financing of a ~15K used mini-ex vs. a ~$30K used full-size backhoe. Either plan will work, but the consequences of a failed backhoe plan vs. a failed mini-ex plan are clearly worse. All of this "investment" is effectively coming out of home equity, so we are talking a potentially ugly end-of-year refinancing hassle if the wrong decision is made. The greater the "investment", the higher my refinancing amount... and, therefore, the higher the business income I have to show for this year to pull it off. Plus the ~30K full-size backhoe option would cross a borrowing threshold that eliminates certain easier home refinancing options.

One key factor you didn't mention is local competition. While the capabilities of the two machines clearly overlap, there is less local competition for the mini-ex than for a full-size backhoe. Lots of big construction companies are low on work and taking anything their big yellow machines can do to survive. In this regard, the niche market for mini-ex services may be somewhat better.

Dougster

SkunkWerX

Dougster,

All are valid points. With an economic slowdown (something we haven't touched here) there is that added factor. Makes it even more of a dicey situation.
Contractor pricing may become more competitve and even cut-throat, as they try to keep cash flowing and their workers working.

There is also vulture aspect of a downturning economy.
We may see more and more equipment go on the chopping block.
Any businesses that extended themselves recently, may find their cashflow isn't what it was in past years, and have that "Fire Sale" you were mentioning.

Maybe develop a strategic partnership with someone in lieu of buying?
You might find you are money ahead using a sub with a Mini-X he is trying to pay off, who will give you low bids just to keep his machine in play?

All of this is just thinking out loud. kicking it around.

I'm sitting here saying to myself, it's March already! It's the time of year when work should be getting ready to boom, but, somehow, I'm not seeing the same signs of it blossoming. This housing mess has a bad trickle down effect, for sure. All the negative economic news makes people skiddish, which fuels even more stagnation.

So, with that said, in this climate, be very cautious as you come out of the starting gate this spring.

Kubota BX2350 and more attachments than I have sense to operate.